That's not a graphics card...

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ukimalefu want, but shouldn't, may anyway
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THIS is a graphics card

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Dayum, that is big.

That's all I wanted to say about that.
ukimalefu want, but shouldn't, may anyway
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The textures are texture maps though; still not able to render fractal noise based procedural textures in real time.

But yeah the RTX3090 is a freaking beast. AMD is going to be dead in the water if they do not release something big. Apple needs to think real hard and swallow their pride.
Those things should be taxed like cigarettes.
That 3090 would be a beast in the new MacPro. But Apple are stubborn asshats; and they keep moving in a direction that is going to make them irrelevant in the creative space.
maurvir Steamed meat popsicle
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avkills posted:
That 3090 would be a beast in the new MacPro. But Apple are stubborn asshats; and they keep moving in a direction that is going to make them irrelevant in the creative space.


Apple has decided to transition into being a toy maker, so I doubt they are terribly concerned.
Pariah Know Your Enemy
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Going way the hell back, Apple has always bent over backwards to make sure that any Mac they offered had, at the very best, barely adequate video on the top of the line models and everything below that had inadequate video.
I would not be at all surprised if there was not some serious discontent at Apple when Intel GMA got good enough to be able to stream HD stutter free.
ukimalefu want, but shouldn't, may anyway
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Seriously, I was only surprised by the physical size of that card, but since you're talking about it...

Quote:
Early graphics performance tests concerning the new Apple Silicon suggest Apple’s eight-core A12Z running macOS 11 currently surpasses the integrated graphics of both the AMD Ryzen 5 4500U and the Intel Core i7-1065G7 chips. That’s promising, given the imminent debut of Apple Silicon A14 chips.


but

Quote:
The problem with the plan is when it comes to third-party GPUs from the likes of Nvidia, AMD or Intel; these (at least at the moment) will not be supported by [Apple] Silicon Macs. This includes those external GPUs used by MacBook Pro and Mac Pro.

Apple’s argument may be that the need for such external GPU systems will be mitigated by the move to more powerful home-baked graphics technologies, which may be true.

The company has also committed to introducing new Intel-based Macs that do support these external systems for some time during the current transition.


https://www.computerworld.com/article/3 ... ssors.html
TOS
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Pariah posted:
Going way the hell back, Apple has always bent over backwards to make sure that any Mac they offered had, at the very best, barely adequate video on the top of the line models and everything below that had inadequate video.
I would not be at all surprised if there was not some serious discontent at Apple when Intel GMA got good enough to be able to stream HD stutter free.


they just don't give a human waste about the pc market

apple has become a $2 trillion company (almost) completely without it
TOS posted:
Pariah posted:
Going way the hell back, Apple has always bent over backwards to make sure that any Mac they offered had, at the very best, barely adequate video on the top of the line models and everything below that had inadequate video.
I would not be at all surprised if there was not some serious discontent at Apple when Intel GMA got good enough to be able to stream HD stutter free.


they just don't give a human waste about the pc market

apple has become a $2 trillion company (almost) completely without it

They need to just keep doing what they doing, split my stock 3 times already. The only share I purchased (it was $36) is an actual paper stock certificate which has the Jobs signature and says Apple Computer. (not Inc) I've got it framed on the wall as an art piece (you can't request certificates anymore from Apple).

I have now only 6 (including the cert) shares since after the split prior this one I cashed in all but 2 of the digital shares (to build a Windows gaming PC nonetheless, hah the irony).
Also I hate how Nvidia is being touted as a Saint with this new gpu line. Decades of monopolistic anti consumerism are magically washed away just because they finally became competitive this single time.

Not that I wouldn't buy it if I were in the market, but the god like praise, please. Makes you wonder if Navi 2x (RDNA 2) due next month worried them (I said it before Su is like the new Jobs).
Aaron_R posted:
Also I hate how Nvidia is being touted as a Saint with this new gpu line. Decades of monopolistic anti consumerism are magically washed away just because they finally became competitive this single time.

Not that I wouldn't buy it if I were in the market, but the god like praise, please. Makes you wonder if Navi 2x (RDNA 2) due next month worried them (I said it before Su is like the new Jobs).


Trust me I am not discounting AMD. They may surprise everyone. Also Intel has some interesting GPU things baking in the oven.

If Apple's full transition to ARM does not allow any GPU from AMD, nVIdia or Intel to be used then Apple might as well just stop pretending that they care about creative people.
ukimalefu want, but shouldn't, may anyway
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that thing on top, is a motherboard

Image
maurvir Steamed meat popsicle
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That is an unusually small motherboard, but yeah, that is also an unusually large graphics card. The two extremes really play off of each other.

Fortunately, cards are supported by their brackets, which are attached to the case - not just the PCIe slot.
dv
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Yeah, it just looks like a triple-slot full-length card. Rare, but not weird.
Pariah Know Your Enemy
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TOS posted:
Pariah posted:
Going way the hell back, Apple has always bent over backwards to make sure that any Mac they offered had, at the very best, barely adequate video on the top of the line models and everything below that had inadequate video.
I would not be at all surprised if there was not some serious discontent at Apple when Intel GMA got good enough to be able to stream HD stutter free.


they just don't give a human waste about the pc market

apple has become a $2 trillion company (almost) completely without it

I cannot help but point out that in the areas I have always said Apple lacked they have enjoyed vastly smaller growth. I would go as far as to suggest that the way Apple has grown is vindication of the positions I have always taken. On the desktop where Apple has long only offered oddball niche form factors they have enjoyed practically no growth.
Lombo Opiofiend
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Every PC makers has no growth. It is not unique to Apple.
maurvir Steamed meat popsicle
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The desktop, and really, even "PC replacement" laptop, are returning to being niche products primarily for businesses and high-end gamers/enthusiasts. The average consumer has largely shifted away from desktops and high-end laptops to their phones, tablets, Chromebooks, consoles, etc.

I hate that, because PCs are vastly more flexible and capable than tablets and phones, but that's the direction I see the industry heading in. Sure, there will always be a contingent of people like myself who actually need a powerful desktop with multiple large displays, but I realize I'm a bit of an exception.

Which is why Apple is turning Macbooks into iOS powered versions of Chromebooks and creating niche desktop solutions that only businesses can afford. The market for affordable home PCs is shrinking rapidly, while the business market is fairly stable for the moment.
Pariah Know Your Enemy
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maurvir posted:
The desktop, and really, even "PC replacement" laptop, are returning to being niche products primarily for businesses and high-end gamers/enthusiasts. The average consumer has largely shifted away from desktops and high-end laptops to their phones, tablets, Chromebooks, consoles, etc.

I hate that, because PCs are vastly more flexible and capable than tablets and phones, but that's the direction I see the industry heading in. Sure, there will always be a contingent of people like myself who actually need a powerful desktop with multiple large displays, but I realize I'm a bit of an exception.

Which is why Apple is turning Macbooks into iOS powered versions of Chromebooks and creating niche desktop solutions that only businesses can afford. The market for affordable home PCs is shrinking rapidly, while the business market is fairly stable for the moment.
A surprising number of people seem to be fine just with a phone which is baffling to me as the "web experience" on a phone strikes me as a what should be a hyperbolic exaggeration of how bad the web can actually be. But it is no joke or exaggeration, the web really is that bad on a phone. Like 1999 using IE pre-popup blocker. "Legit" sites today are as bad as the very worst mouse trapping porno sites were 20 years ago.

I keep a sharp eye on the used market and low end laptops are clearly very popular and mid and lower end desktops have faded some but are still available in decent quantity. Tablets are pretty rare and Chromebooks also very rarely show up.
My impression is that very few people outside education use Chromebooks and tablets never found their niche.
TOS
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maurvir posted:
The desktop, and really, even "PC replacement" laptop, are returning to being niche products primarily for businesses and high-end gamers/enthusiasts. The average consumer has largely shifted away from desktops and high-end laptops to their phones, tablets, Chromebooks, consoles, etc.

I hate that, because PCs are vastly more flexible and capable than tablets and phones, but that's the direction I see the industry heading in. Sure, there will always be a contingent of people like myself who actually need a powerful desktop with multiple large displays, but I realize I'm a bit of an exception.

Which is why Apple is turning Macbooks into iOS powered versions of Chromebooks and creating niche desktop solutions that only businesses can afford. The market for affordable home PCs is shrinking rapidly, while the business market is fairly stable for the moment.


i don't think covid is going to do the business market any favours

basically anything relating to traditional business infrastructure is going to take a hit, especially commercial real estate, but i don't imagine the pc market is going to be an exception

honestly, is any company going to do bulk buying for the foreseeable future?
maurvir Steamed meat popsicle
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There will definitely be a major slowdown in PC purchasing for a while, but assuming this isn't the lead-up to the apocalypse, businesses will eventually need new PCs. I'd give it a year or two, but yes, eventually I anticipate business class machines will start moving again.

The consumer market for desktop PCs, on the other hand, may be close to dead by then.
TOS
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this bad boy can mine so many bitcoins
Pariah Know Your Enemy
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maurvir posted:
There will definitely be a major slowdown in PC purchasing for a while, but assuming this isn't the lead-up to the apocalypse, businesses will eventually need new PCs. I'd give it a year or two, but yes, eventually I anticipate business class machines will start moving again.

The consumer market for desktop PCs, on the other hand, may be close to dead by then.

Aside from gaming PCs I think the consumer market for desktop computers died quite awhile ago. Desktops and laptops have moved into a long replacement cycle that seems to be rapidly approaching 10 years and more. I mean, my old Dell has an 8 year old CPU in it and I see nothing coming along that would obsolete this thing in the foreseeable future.
macnuke Afar
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My desktop is an 09.
that's 11 years.
I don't see it being replaced as long as it's running for years.
maurvir Steamed meat popsicle
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Before I got a killer deal on an i5-8400, I planned to run my i7-3770 until the wheels fell off (so to speak). However, when I found a great deal on an i5-8400 and 16GB of RAM, I decided to do some upgrades. I initially got my current system up for about $120 - and the old i7-3770 core went into my Linux machine. I later added a proper NVME SSD that ran me another $100, but I could have lived with the older SATA SSD.

That's pretty much how I've rolled. I keep using stuff until I can get a really great deal on new parts, then upgrade as I can. The only downside is that the RAM is DDR4-2133, not DDR4-2666, but in practice, I can't really "feel" that it is slower memory.
Mr. T Dude extraordinaire
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Haven't posted in awhile, but wanted to say that I'm the proud owner of a 12 year-old six-core, 12-thread, water-cooled x58 i7 @4.6GHz.

Over the years, I've added some RAM, SSDs, swapped out the 920 I had in there originally for a second-hand 980X, and upgraded the GPU a whopping five times.

My next stop: RTX 3080.
Why?
Because Moore's Law started dying years ago, and this is a weirdly reasonable thing to do.
dv
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Mr. T posted:
Haven't posted in awhile, but wanted to say that I'm the proud owner of a 12 year-old six-core, 12-thread, water-cooled x58 i7 @4.6GHz.

Over the years, I've added some RAM, SSDs, swapped out the 920 I had in there originally for a second-hand 980X, and upgraded the GPU a whopping five times.

My next stop: RTX 3080.
Why?
Because Moore's Law started dying years ago, and this is a weirdly reasonable thing to do.


Similar boat. Not as into the high end gear as you, but I've got a 3570k on its fourth GPU in 7 years. RAM was bumped once and I'm on my third SSD.
TOS
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maurvir Steamed meat popsicle
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I am still amazed that there are idiots out there willing to pay more than 2x retail to a scalper for a freaking mass-produced video card. I can almost understand people getting carried away on Ebay and paying more than retail, as I've done that a couple of times myself, but 2x retail? No.

Just wait a few weeks and buy one at regular price.
ukimalefu want, but shouldn't, may anyway
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maurvir posted:
I am still amazed that there are idiots out there willing to pay more than 2x retail to a scalper for a freaking mass-produced video card. I can almost understand people getting carried away on Ebay and paying more than retail, as I've done that a couple of times myself, but 2x retail? No.

Just wait a few weeks and buy one at regular price.


If you don't buy it NOW you're not a real gamer!

Gaming at 4k with everything on ultra at 90 FPS is the only way!

some people buy big trucks, some people buy red convertibles, some people buy... graphics cards?
Mr. T Dude extraordinaire
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Lol. It's pretty insane. You can find a used 2080 Ti on eBay for merely double fair market value, and it's only 30% slower than the 3080.
TOS
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i still can't tell these graphic cards apart
macnuke Afar
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My 580 runs what I want.
Ima eat popcorn and let you guys fight over that spensive human waste.
Mr. T Dude extraordinaire
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macnuke posted:
My 580 runs what I want.
Ima eat popcorn and let you guys fight over that spensive human waste.

I've got a 980 Ti right now. You and I are in the same ballpark performance-wise.

For screen-rendered games, I'm totally fine with roughly 60FPS, occasional FPS dips, and MSAA. I appreciate the fact that I have enough oomph to run super sampling (NV calls it DSR) on older titles. Works especially well for games that lack MIP mapping, like Metropolis Street Racer in Redream. I do appreciate real time ray-tracing on newer cards, but most games don't take advantage of it, so I wouldn't mind waiting...

...But my main reason for upgrading is VR. VR is extraordinarily demanding. You have to render a stereo image, you have to compensate for lens distortion, you have to hit a rock-solid 90FPS, and you need gobs of super sampling.

Anything less is VERY noticeable. It's not bad in the sense that it becomes unplayable or anything. It's kinda hard to explain... It's like once you hit 90FPS, your brain seems to just accept the virtual world as real --Below that, it just feels like a parlor trick.
ukimalefu want, but shouldn't, may anyway
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I have an Intel HD 5000 right now and I'm loving it
Reports of stability problems with non founder RTX 300 series cards...uh oh....looks like cheap power delivery filters. This could tip the balance in favor of AMD if they actually deliver something "really" good.
avkills posted:
Reports of stability problems with non founder RTX 300 series cards...uh oh....looks like cheap power delivery filters. This could tip the balance in favor of AMD if they actually deliver something "really" good.

You won't know until the 28th (RDNA 2 event) but not to worry if you want tech competition carnage you can see AMD strike another blow to Intel on the 8th (Zen 3 event).
arkayn Aaarrrggghhhh
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avkills posted:
Reports of stability problems with non founder RTX 300 series cards...uh oh....looks like cheap power delivery filters. This could tip the balance in favor of AMD if they actually deliver something "really" good.


Technically, there is no founders card. As even NVIDIA used a custom PCB.

This video explains why.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6bUUEEe-X8
arkayn posted:
avkills posted:
Reports of stability problems with non founder RTX 300 series cards...uh oh....looks like cheap power delivery filters. This could tip the balance in favor of AMD if they actually deliver something "really" good.


Technically, there is no founders card. As even NVIDIA used a custom PCB.

This video explains why.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6bUUEEe-X8


I know; but all the goofs on YouTube are referring to the nVidia branded ones as founder's editions. Whatever. Still not good.
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That's not a graphics card...