Apple releases new MacBook Pros

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Not a bad update, 6-core i9 available and 32GB BTO. Still a little bummed on the GPU side. Should have had a 8GB BTO option and an nVidia BTO option. But still not a bad update.
ukimalefu Wasn't me
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wut? out of nowhere? cool I guess

I saw a rumor today that apple plans to update ALL hardware this fall, including mac minis
That rumor came out yesterday; I was not expecting anything to be updated this quick. A fully pimped MBPro has a nice hefty price though now. Hopefully Barefeats has some benchmarks soon on the 6-core i9. It is highly possible that needing a desktop pro machine for 99% of everything will no longer be required.
gd Ya boi, Guzma
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Well this was a surprise. Seems mighty tempting.
Donkey Butter jerk face
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that thing looks nice
dv
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avkills posted:
That rumor came out yesterday; I was not expecting anything to be updated this quick. A fully pimped MBPro has a nice hefty price though now. Hopefully Barefeats has some benchmarks soon on the 6-core i9. It is highly possible that needing a desktop pro machine for 99% of everything will no longer be required.


The CPU is only useful if you can run it full-tilt long enough to get your work done.

Doubt it.
ukimalefu Wasn't me
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oh by the way, here they are

https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/

I hate to be the one to say something negative but I will anyway

as always, barely enough ram, expensive to upgrade (200$ to go from 8 to 16 gb)(and you can't add ram yourself)
maurvir Perfectly balanced - mostly
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ukimalefu posted:
oh by the way, here they are

https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/

I hate to be the one to say something negative but I will anyway

as always, barely enough ram, expensive to upgrade (200$ to go from 8 to 16 gb)(and you can't add ram yourself)


Apple has always screwed users on RAM almost from day 1 (and definitely from day 1 of the Mac line). This is why hacks are so popular. You can build a beast of a Mac for less than half the price of all but the most expensive legit Macs.

When MacOS switches to ARM, and the Intel days are over, we will miss being able to build our own. :(
Pariah Know Your Enemy
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ukimalefu posted:
oh by the way, here they are

https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/

I hate to be the one to say something negative but I will anyway

as always, barely enough ram, expensive to upgrade (200$ to go from 8 to 16 gb)(and you can't add ram yourself)

A brand new "pro" machine should have at least 16GB of ram. I don't do anything particularly demanding on my PC yet I am routinely using over 8GB of ram out of the 12GB I have.
The increased RAM required is more than likely linked to bloated OS or the OS doing a lot more than they used to. More complicated window managers that take more memory. But yeah my hack is sitting around 7-8GB of wired memory. But that may because I have 16GB. Someone with 8GB should see how much is wired using TOP.
ukimalefu Wasn't me
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avkills posted:
The increased RAM required is more than likely linked to bloated OS or the OS doing a lot more than they used to. More complicated window managers that take more memory. But yeah my hack is sitting around 7-8GB of wired memory. But that may because I have 16GB. Someone with 8GB should see how much is wired using TOP.


I blame web browsers. ALL web browsers. You have RAM? they'll eat it all. FEED ME SEYMOUR!
Metacell Chocolate Brahma
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It was the case with previous Macbook Pros that using more than 8GB required a more power hungry memory management unit that would result in shortened battery life, according to Apple.
macnuke Afar
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obvs not a cultural imperialist
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$4000 if you want a 2.9GHz system with 32GB of RAM and a 1TB SSD.

An additional $3000 if you want to upgrade that to a 4TB SSD.
maurvir Perfectly balanced - mostly
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macnuke posted:
https://www.howtogeek.com/fyi/google-chrome-will-start-using-10-more-ram-now-thanks-to-spectre/

speaking of RAM... that should improve Chrome on the new MacBooks :p


Note, this will make adblocking even more attractive, as every freaking iframe will get its own rendering process. My Mac has 16GB, and my Windows box 32GB, of RAM, but the older laptops might grind to a halt if this becomes a thing.
macnuke Afar
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maurvir posted:
macnuke posted:
https://www.howtogeek.com/fyi/google-chrome-will-start-using-10-more-ram-now-thanks-to-spectre/

speaking of RAM... that should improve Chrome on the new MacBooks :p


Note, this will make adblocking even more attractive, as every freaking iframe will get its own rendering process. My Mac has 16GB, and my Windows box 32GB, of RAM, but the older laptops might grind to a halt if this becomes a thing.


I'd prolly stick with safari and uBlock
leave the java and flash off.
and just not use Chrome.
TOS
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almost $4k

jesus christ
obvs not a cultural imperialist
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Or, like I said, upgrade the SSD, and it's $7,000.
macnuke Afar
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I realize banal sex came with that purchase...
anything else ?
macnuke posted:
I realize banal sex came with that purchase...
anything else ?


Only if you BTO RAM and SSD options.
gd Ya boi, Guzma
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obvs posted:
$4000 if you want a 2.9GHz system with 32GB of RAM and a 1TB SSD.

An additional $3000 if you want to upgrade that to a 4TB SSD.



Jesus stick fiddling Christ! $3200 to be exact. Financially, it's better to get the 512 GB and get a 4 TB external for a fraction of the price.

For the cost of a fully specced out MBP 15 inch ($6699), Justine can get a new transmission on the Nissan and have spare cash, I could restore the Jag to mint condition, or pay for about 51% of my tuition of the 2018-2019 school year.


Btw, doing the same thing for the iMac Pro dings you at $13,199.00. I can pay for one year's tuition with that money.


Anyone want to fund my tuition for the price of a maxed out iMac Pro?
Metacell Chocolate Brahma
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What do you guys expect? You're looking at the most expensive options you can get from Apple. You're never supposed to buy those. When these new computers come out, you go and buy the second cheapest offering from last year off the refurb list.
dv
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Metacell posted:
What do you guys expect? You're looking at the most expensive options you can get from Apple. You're never supposed to buy those. When these new computers come out, you go and buy the second cheapest offering from last year off the refurb list.


Goes great with that pre-leased Toyota product you buy every 10-15 years, in the one car garage detached from a 1200 sqft house in a nice older neighborhood that isn't super-trendy, in a town with good schools...

People don't want to do the smart thing. Even when they do it anyway. :evil:
Pariah Know Your Enemy
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How fast does thermal throttling come into play with a powerful laptop?
Metacell Chocolate Brahma
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I haven't noticed, but the 15" with Radeons have fans in them. I don't play Skyrim without being plugged in though. You can control some of the stuff in System Preferences/Control Panel for behavior when you are plugged in or not.
TOS
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i've been hearing talk about apple's potentially illegal repair practices
ukimalefu Wasn't me
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TOS posted:
i've been hearing talk about apple's potentially illegal repair practices


:squint:

care to explain, and/or post links?

Currently shipping Apple devices simply can NOT be repaired in most cases because it's all super tiny parts soldered to tightly packed motherboards, and if they do "repair" stuff, it's usually really just replacing parts. I would only trust apple authorized people to do any of that because they're supposed to know what they're doing. There's a reason Apple sometimes just give people a new device, it's more convenient for them to do that instead of trying to repair something. Apple simply want to avoid wasting time and money working on stuff people break. It may seem like a cliche but I've seen it myself, people breaking things trying to fix them themselves, to "save money" or something, only to make things worst and having to go to a repair center and lie: "I don't know what happened, it just stopped working".

I understand people wanting "the right to repair", but most people aren't able to do it, or even find the parts needed.

And I doubt there's much different with other manufacturers, if you want pretty super thin devices, phones, laptops, whatever.

I don't like it either, I've upgraded every computer I've ever used. Repaired? replacing HDs is the most I've done. But electronic devices these days are simply not made to be repaired. If people expect manufacturers to be made to build "repairable" consumer devices, well, that's not gonna happen. The only exception would be "build your own PC" I suppose, and that's not for everybody, but you can't build your own cell phone yet.

-

Damn, I hate writing long posts.
obvs not a cultural imperialist
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ukimalefu posted:
TOS posted:
i've been hearing talk about apple's potentially illegal repair practices


:squint:

care to explain, and/or post links?

Currently shipping Apple devices simply can NOT be repaired in most cases because it's all super tiny parts soldered to tightly packed motherboards, and if they do "repair" stuff, it's usually really just replacing parts. I would only trust apple authorized people to do any of that because they're supposed to know what they're doing. There's a reason Apple sometimes just give people a new device, it's more convenient for them to do that instead of trying to repair something. Apple simply want to avoid wasting time and money working on stuff people break. It may seem like a cliche but I've seen it myself, people breaking things trying to fix them themselves, to "save money" or something, only to make things worst and having to go to a repair center and lie: "I don't know what happened, it just stopped working".

I understand people wanting "the right to repair", but most people aren't able to do it, or even find the parts needed.

And I doubt there's much different with other manufacturers, if you want pretty super thin devices, phones, laptops, whatever.

I don't like it either, I've upgraded every computer I've ever used. Repaired? replacing HDs is the most I've done. But electronic devices these days are simply not made to be repaired. If people expect manufacturers to be made to build "repairable" consumer devices, well, that's not gonna happen. The only exception would be "build your own PC" I suppose, and that's not for everybody, but you can't build your own cell phone yet.

-

Damn, I hate writing long posts.
Apple has intentionally bricked successfully repaired phones, not provided warranties when they were legally required to do so, and intentionally made it difficult to repair devices when they were required to not do so.
It is super time consuming to repair multi level circuit boards and surface mounted IC parts. So yeah it is a lot easier for Apple to just replace boards or hard drives or displays; or the whole thing. I am sure there are some people who could repair this stuff down to the component level, but the required tools are very expensive and the skill is years and years of doing. We had ETs in the Navy who could do this kind of stuff; who had gone to specialty schools. Even the standard soldering course during ET (Electronic Tech) training was pretty intense. Instructors would look at solder joints under microscopes.

Uki nailed it, it just isn't practical.
maurvir Perfectly balanced - mostly
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Apple has a well documented history of adding things to iOS to break iPhones and iPads that use non-Apple supplied parts. It's kind of obvious when your device works fine until you update, then it "breaks"

They were successfully sued in at least one country in the EU over it, though I don't think the EU itself has keel-hauled them for that particular uncouth individual move.
ukimalefu Wasn't me
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maurvir posted:
Apple has a well documented history of adding things to iOS to break iPhones and iPads that use non-Apple supplied parts. It's kind of obvious when your device works fine until you update, then it "breaks"

They were successfully sued in at least one country in the EU over it, though I don't think the EU itself has keel-hauled them for that particular uncouth individual move.


ok, anything beyond "void warranty" and maybe even charging extra to work on an "improperly" repaired device, would be unacceptable.
dv
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ukimalefu Wasn't me
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dv
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maurvir posted:
Apple has a well documented history of adding things to iOS to break iPhones and iPads that use non-Apple supplied parts. It's kind of obvious when your device works fine until you update, then it "breaks"

They were successfully sued in at least one country in the EU over it, though I don't think the EU itself has keel-hauled them for that particular uncouth individual move.


Where do those parts come from, exactly? When you design/trademark/patent as many things as Apple does, and using generic/standard parts is basically cancer to your business model...

Combining two broken machines to make one working one is a time honored tradition I'd hate to see Apple stop, but those unbranded-but-mysteriously-Apple-compatible components that come from an unknown factory are probably breaking laws that the Chinese don't care to bother enforcing.
Donkey Butter jerk face
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every time, without fail. Hey here is a new product that I'm not going to buy because I don't need it or cannot afford it, so let me tell all those that choose to spend their money on it why it's stupid for them to do so. :eyeroll:

When Bugatti came out with the Chiron that costs over $2,000,000 I'm sure you lot were the first to mention why your Daewoo was better, and that only morons would buy a Chiron.
gd Ya boi, Guzma
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Donkey Butter posted:
every time, without fail. Hey here is a new product that I'm not going to buy because I don't need it or cannot afford it, so let me tell all those that choose to spend their money on it why it's stupid for them to do so. :eyeroll:

When Bugatti came out with the Chiron that costs over $2,000,000 I'm sure you lot were the first to mention why your Daewoo was better, and that only morons would buy a Chiron.



You might have a point, however, cars don't become obsolete as fast as a computer does. If you try to buy the highest specced computer you can at a $13k price, it is very likely that in a couple years it will be outperformed by an average computer. At which point, spending $1500 now and then $1500 in 4 years would have been more cost effective. It will take quite a few decades before a Camry can outperform a Chiron, and it will never have the same craftsmanship, quality (luxury wise), soul, prestige, pedigree, etc as the Bugatti. On the other hand, those things are all the same between a $1500 MBP and the $7k MBP.
There is also the difference between putting in the required parts that would make, say, a fan easily replacable vs. soldering it in.

-----

But <sigh> I guess I WILL not be buying a new MBP because I prefer physical buttons.
obvs not a cultural imperialist
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I specifically bought the last generation of MacBook Pro that had function keys instead of the stupid touch bar. I figure that the next time I'm in the market for a computer will probably be 3-4 years from now, and by then who knows what kind of changes Apple will have made. They'll probably remove the hinge from MacBook Pros because it was a moving part, and then they'll remove keys completely and then the touchpad, and then, oh, what do you know, it's an iPad.
maurvir Perfectly balanced - mostly
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dv posted:
maurvir posted:
Apple has a well documented history of adding things to iOS to break iPhones and iPads that use non-Apple supplied parts. It's kind of obvious when your device works fine until you update, then it "breaks"

They were successfully sued in at least one country in the EU over it, though I don't think the EU itself has keel-hauled them for that particular uncouth individual move.


Where do those parts come from, exactly? When you design/trademark/patent as many things as Apple does, and using generic/standard parts is basically cancer to your business model...

Combining two broken machines to make one working one is a time honored tradition I'd hate to see Apple stop, but those unbranded-but-mysteriously-Apple-compatible components that come from an unknown factory are probably breaking laws that the Chinese don't care to bother enforcing.


Punishing the user by having your software specifically search for and disable parts after the fact is despicable unless there is a safety issue (like bad batteries). Apple was taking successfully repaired devices and bricking them after the fact through an OS update. I don't care where the part came from, if that ever happened to me, it would be the absolute LAST iDevice I ever bought, and I would make sure everyone I knew found out why.

It was a dick move and Apple should have been called out for it a lot worse than they did.
maurvir posted:
dv posted:
maurvir posted:
Apple has a well documented history of adding things to iOS to break iPhones and iPads that use non-Apple supplied parts. It's kind of obvious when your device works fine until you update, then it "breaks"

They were successfully sued in at least one country in the EU over it, though I don't think the EU itself has keel-hauled them for that particular uncouth individual move.


Where do those parts come from, exactly? When you design/trademark/patent as many things as Apple does, and using generic/standard parts is basically cancer to your business model...

Combining two broken machines to make one working one is a time honored tradition I'd hate to see Apple stop, but those unbranded-but-mysteriously-Apple-compatible components that come from an unknown factory are probably breaking laws that the Chinese don't care to bother enforcing.


Punishing the user by having your software specifically search for and disable parts after the fact is despicable unless there is a safety issue (like bad batteries). Apple was taking successfully repaired devices and bricking them after the fact through an OS update. I don't care where the part came from, if that ever happened to me, it would be the absolute LAST iDevice I ever bought, and I would make sure everyone I knew found out why.

It was a dick move and Apple should have been called out for it a lot worse than they did.

So what was the outcome of the EU investigation? Because I think you are attributing to malice what can be explained by Apple not testing iOS updates on repairs with non-Apple parts, and Touch ID/Secure Enclave turning out to be special parts, quite important, and things that the OS was designed to expect to be legit.
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Apple releases new MacBook Pros

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