Outbreak of Coronavirus

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ukimalefu
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Post by ukimalefu »

Can You Still Get COVID After You've Had the Vaccine?

Reports are trickling in of people who contracted COVID-19 even though they were vaccinated, like these four people in Oregon and these 12 in Hawaii. But these are just a few cases out of millions vaccinated. New research confirms that the vaccines are overwhelmingly effective in real-world use, and that breakthrough cases like these are rare.

But damn deniers/anti-maskers are gonna love this news :worriedfrown:

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Post by macnuke »

Wife’s coworker (ICU nurse) came down with a nasty case of Covid 3 weeks post second vaccination

People that do not succeed in politics usually tell the truth too often.

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Post by DukeofNuke »

Well, that's just what I wanted to hear ... :worriedfrown:

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Post by macnuke »

I won’t stop wearing a mask and social distancing until the death count drops significantly

People that do not succeed in politics usually tell the truth too often.

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Post by obvs »

macnuke wrote: Tue Mar 30, 2021 10:38 am

Wife’s coworker (ICU nurse) came down with a nasty case of Covid 3 weeks post second vaccination

That's within the incubation period, though, right?

They didn't estimate that you have your highest immunity until weeks after your second shot, but the incubation period for COVID could also be a few weeks. It means that the coworker could have been exposed after the first shot or around the time of the second shot.

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Post by macnuke »

but what are the odds the first shot didn't provide enough for just the short time to get the boost.
so much human waste unknown about the dam thing you can never tell.

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Post by DEyncourt »

Even after getting both of the vaccination shots--if two are required--and even granting the time for the body to develop antibodies, there is about a 5% chance for the vaccination to fail. It ain't perfect.

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Post by ukimalefu »

Real-world evidence shows that the COVID-19 vaccines work

Three months after the United States’ COVID-19 vaccination campaign began, researchers are starting to collect data showing that the vaccines are just as good in the real world as they were in the clinical trials testing them. Recent studies have consistently shown that the vaccines don’t just protect against symptoms — they reduce the risk that someone will get infected with the coronavirus, a signal that they’ll reduce the spread of the virus, not just prevent sickness.

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Post by ukimalefu »

How to score a COVID-19 vaccine appointment
The process of finding an appointment can be incredibly frustrating; here are some strategies that may help

https://www.theverge.com/22279023/covid ... ent-how-to

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Post by TOS »

here in ontario, the vaccination program is falling apart

turns out putting in charge incompetent morons who ignore experts is not a good idea.

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Post by juice »

TOS wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:03 am

here in ontario, the vaccination program is falling apart

turns out putting in charge incompetent morons who ignore experts is not a good idea.

It's even better when the morons blame the experts for the worsening situation.

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Post by DEyncourt »

In an abundance of caution the FDA and CDC is are recommending a TEMPORARY stoppage in the administration of the single-shot Johnson & Johnson vaccination. There have been 6 cases of people getting blood clots which formed in the veins draining blood from the brain which apparently caused the death of one person.

BUT it should be noted that this is out of 6.8 M dosages of the J&J shot that have been given in the US so this is literally a less than one-in-a-million chance, perhaps double that if you are female because all of those 6 cases occurred in female recipients (currently no link to gender has been determined).

AND this should be balanced against the current mortality rate for getting COVID-19: in the US there have been over 31 M cases which resulted in 563 K deaths or a fatality rate of 1.8% (which is over 20 K times the chance of getting those blood clots).

Given those odds, if I hadn't gotten the Moderna shots I would still take my chances with the J&J shot if that were the only one available to me.

EDIT: D'oh! Incorrect government agency. Ack--they were both involved in this decision.

Last edited by DEyncourt on Wed Apr 14, 2021 12:29 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by obvs »

Even with the AstraZenica one, the odds still seem to indicate that it's better to take the shot.

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Post by DEyncourt »

obvs wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 5:23 pm

Even with the AstraZenica one, the odds still seem to indicate that it's better to take the shot.

I agree with you, although there are some differences.

Here was my previous post about the "problems" with the AstraZenica vaccine. I should point out that there were further studies upon the AstraZenica shot which found other blood-clotting problems beyond deep-vein thrombosis (DVT). Still Dr. Novella's assessment was likewise: while those problems were more troubling because they were more common than found in the general population, similar to the case with the J&J vaccine, death from contracting COVID-19 is many times more probable than a possible death from any of the blood clot problems associated with the AstraZenica vaccine.

BUT DVT is common enough that it HAS a name and has drug therapies and other treatments and even drug commercials.

The blood clotting in the veins draining the brain is so uncommon that it does NOT have a name (or at least not one that made the news). It may be that this condition will be unique to only these six women who received the J&J shot (in which case this condition probably would get a name that should closely associate it with COVID-19).

AND even still: while one possibly preventable death is troubling, anyone who is worried about the J&J shot over this should be MORE concerned about the 1.8% fatality rate for COVID-19 (so far, at least in the US). If you can get any of the vaccines, take it ASAP.

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Post by DEyncourt »

On her show tonight Rachel Maddow had on the US Surgeon General, Dr. Vivek Murthy. Among other topics they discussed the stoppage of the J&J vaccine. Dr. Murthy added a detail I had not heard: those 6 women also had low platelet counts. This is very odd considering that with clotting one might expect an increased platelet count considering how platelets are one of the factors which aids in blood clot formation. Dr. Murthy also noted that this information is quite new and the low platelet counts are not (yet) necessarily connected to those women having received the J&J shot.

Just an idea off the top of my head: it might be that all six women had a pre-existing (medically induced?) condition creating the low platelet counts thus not related to the J&J shot BUT may indicate that people scheduled to get one of the shots should undergo a test for low platelet counts, so if found, these people shouldn't be given the J&J shot. If it was medically induced, then other people taking a similar rare combination of drugs could be screened from being given the J&J shot.

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Post by DEyncourt »

Hmm, that condition of "blood clotting in the veins draining the brain" does have a name: cerebral venous sinus thrombosis (CVST). I learned this from Dr. Steven Novella's weekly column on science/medical news. It is still a very rare condition and that name was noted in the joint statement from the FDA and the CDC.

Dr, Novella also notes that the means for creating the vaccines are different, with both the Pfizer and Modern vaccines being mRNA vaccines while both the J&J and AstraZeneca vaccines being modified adenovirus vaccines. There still is uncertainty as to whether or not the blood clotting that SOME receivers of the latter two vaccines have gotten are necessarily linked by them being modified adenovirus vaccines.

D'oh! I am not a doctor so I didn't have this knowledge beforehand, but the low platelet counts in those rare recipients of the J&J shot could be CAUSED by that blood clotting itself. Of course that makes sense to me AFTER having it explained to me. There is a condition called thrombotic thrombocytopenic purpura in which blood clotting specifically in small blood vessels can cause "purple" bruises to appear seemingly randomly around the body, and one of the results of having this condition is that the sufferer can have a low platelet count.

Dr. Novella also provided a list of symptoms of suffering from CVST to watch for:

  • severe headaches

  • confusion

  • dizziness

  • trouble speaking or difficulty understanding speech

  • numbness or weakness in the face/arm/leg

  • trouble seeing

  • trouble walking

  • loss of balance or coordination

Fortunately most of these are quite distinct from COVID-19 symptoms, so if you or anyone you know got the J&J shot and has any of these symptoms, please go to an emergency room or take that person to an emergency room.

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Post by DEyncourt »

On my way to my dialysis treatment I began to listen to this week's Skeptics' Guide to the Universe (epidose 822, dated April 10, 2021). I should point out that usually they record on Wednesdays (though Dr. Novella edits the recording then posts it on the following Saturday), so some of the following info is over a week old and might be passed by more recent news.

They began with COVID-19 news specifically on the AstraZenica (AZ) vaccine (which I will again point out is not given in the US [yet], only in Europe). Dr. Novella noted that one of the blood clotting problems beyond DVT that was found was CVST. Like with the J&J shot all of the AZ recipients who had CVST were female. Unlike with the J&J shot, all of those who had CVST were under 55 years old and there was more than one death. These cases are still very rare compared to the overall population who have gotten the AZ shot and there is a proposal in some countries to limit the new recipients to those who are 55 and older, but the damage has been done: people have begun to refuse the AZ shot even when no alternate shot was available. Again, the odds for death by CVST when taking the AZ vaccine are vanishingly small compared to dying from COVID-19, but humans are very bad at assessing risks. Heh, I just watched tonight's Colbert Report Late Show and Colbert featured an "interview" with a woman (likely a staff member) who complained about the news reporting on the links between CVST and the J&J shot. She pointed out that the odds for a woman to get very serious side-effects from any of the birth control drugs are much, MUCH greater than the odds for that same woman to suffer from CVST due to the J&J shot, but which story gets the headlines now?

This is very problematic because unlike all the other vaccines the AZ vaccine does not require any refrigeration. It was hoped that having a much longer shelf light that the AZ shot could be distributed in poorer countries, many of which--especially in remoter locations--could not provide the required refrigeration for those other vaccines.

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Post by DukeofNuke »

Maybe combine the J&J vaccine with a months worth of clopidogrel ?

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Image

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Post by TOS »

pfizer ceo says third dose needed within a year

Pfizer CEO Albert Bourla said people will “likely” need a third dose of a Covid-19 vaccine within 12 months of getting fully vaccinated. His comments were made public Thursday but were taped April 1.

Bourla said it’s possible people will need to get vaccinated against the coronavirus annually.

“We need to see what would be the sequence, and for how often we need to do that, that remains to be seen,” he told CNBC’s Bertha Coombs during an event with CVS Health. “A likely scenario is that there will be likely a need for a third dose, somewhere between six and 12 months and then from there, there will be an annual revaccination, but all of that needs to be confirmed. And again, the variants will play a key role.”

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Post by DEyncourt »

DukeofNuke wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 8:35 am

Maybe combine the J&J vaccine with a months worth of clopidogrel ?

I looked up clopidogrel on Wikipedia. One of the more severe side effects of that drug is thrombotic thrombocytopenic purpura, so perhaps not?

It also says:

In 2018, [clopidogrel] was the 39th most commonly prescribed medication in the United States, with more than 20 million prescriptions[/url].

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Post by TOS »

a bit of googling and everybody's dr. house

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Post by obvs »

TOS wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 4:02 pm

pfizer ceo says third dose needed within a year

Pfizer CEO Albert Bourla said people will “likely” need a third dose of a Covid-19 vaccine within 12 months of getting fully vaccinated. His comments were made public Thursday but were taped April 1.

Bourla said it’s possible people will need to get vaccinated against the coronavirus annually.

“We need to see what would be the sequence, and for how often we need to do that, that remains to be seen,” he told CNBC’s Bertha Coombs during an event with CVS Health. “A likely scenario is that there will be likely a need for a third dose, somewhere between six and 12 months and then from there, there will be an annual revaccination, but all of that needs to be confirmed. And again, the variants will play a key role.”

I kind of expected this.

I'm fine getting another covid shot. :shrug:

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Post by Pariah »

How much you want to bet the blood clots were caused by an interaction with birth control pills?

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Post by DEyncourt »

Pariah wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:59 pm

How much you want to bet the blood clots were caused by an interaction with birth control pills?

For their Moment of Zen on Tuesday's Daily [Social Distancing] Show, they repeated some of those warnings during commecials for medical products which mentioned blood clots as a possible side effect.

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Post by DukeofNuke »

DEyncourt wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 4:14 pm
DukeofNuke wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 8:35 am

Maybe combine the J&J vaccine with a months worth of clopidogrel ?

I looked up clopidogrel on Wikipedia. One of the more severe side effects of that drug is thrombotic thrombocytopenic purpura, so perhaps not?

It also says:

In 2018, [clopidogrel] was the 39th most commonly prescribed medication in the United States, with more than 20 million prescriptions[/url].

I've been taking it for years. Cheap and effective blood thinner.

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Post by TOS »

i really, really, really hate having doug ford as my premier

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Post by juice »

TOS wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 9:30 pm

i really, really, really hate having doug ford as my premier

I'll trade you Ford for Pete Ricketts

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Post by TOS »

juice wrote: Sat Apr 17, 2021 8:43 am
TOS wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 9:30 pm

i really, really, really hate having doug ford as my premier

I'll trade you Ford for Pete Ricketts

i think we're worse off in terms of covid

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Post by juice »

TOS wrote: Sat Apr 17, 2021 9:33 pm
juice wrote: Sat Apr 17, 2021 8:43 am
TOS wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 9:30 pm

i really, really, really hate having doug ford as my premier

I'll trade you Ford for Pete Ricketts

i think we're worse off in terms of covid

Only due to population density, I assure you. There is no one worse than Ricketts.

In the last week he issued a proclamation on second amendment rights and declined to accept refugee children.

Pro-life Christian, my ass.

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Post by ukimalefu »

animals get covid too

https://gizmodo.com/great-we-gave-covid ... 1846713001

article is about otters, but it mentions other animals, including cats and dogs, so please keep your pets in mind at all times, including maybe keeping them away from idiots that don't wear masks?

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Post by TOS »

how doug ford made ontario a global laughingstock

he recently announced that playgrounds would close (without any scientific basis for doing so) and, worse, that police forces were given the authority to randomly stop people and ask why they're out and about instead of staying at home

jaws dropped province-wide at that last point, and almost every police force announced they wouldn't be carrying it out (though notably the opp, the ontario provincial police, were on board)

even alex jones slammed doug ford

then doug ford had to isolate at home, but went silent because it turns out he doesn't know how to use a laptop or a smartphone ... apparently he uses a ten-year-old blackberry

i knew he was going to be a wasteful premier, but i didn't know he was going to be this bad

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Post by DukeofNuke »

So, when do you guys get a chance to vote him out?

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Post by TOS »

next year

today he held a tearful press conference but didn't accept any responsibility at all

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Post by DukeofNuke »

His brother was such an uncouth individual, looks like you guys would have known better.
Did Doug had out red baseball caps and have boat parades?

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Post by TOS »

people were sick to death of the previously governing liberals, led by a (horrors!) out-of-the-closet lesbian

who would have done a million times better in all this than doug ford

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Post by DEyncourt »

Today the CDC board which evaluates the vaccines has decided to allow the continued use of the J&J vaccine in the US without making any restrictions. Basically that board decided that the rate of CVST was so rare--which is now up to seven cases, all of whom were women under 45 in age--that it was outweighed by the benefits of getting the population vaccinated.

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Post by TOS »

the indian variant has me very nervous

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Post by DEyncourt »

Let me correct a number in my previous post: in the US there have been 15 cases of CVST (unclear on the number of deaths beyond the one previously reported) among recipients of the J&J shot. Again, all of these cases happened to women under 50 in age.

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